Jump to content


Photo

Romelu Lukaku


  • This topic is locked This topic is locked
40 replies to this topic

#1 TheGoon

TheGoon

    GMFC Supporter

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 3765 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Greenock, what of it?

Posted 19 September 2017 - 01:27 PM

Posting this here because we had a similar chant not long ago for Oyenuga. For anyone unsure of what I'm on about, here you go - https://t.co/5FMSDRxNZs

I joined in with the Kudus chant. It was stupid, it is stereotyping, but the guy himself admitted hr liked it. Perhaps that's why I'm struggling to be offended by this, when many others are.

There are so many worse chants/songs belted out at games every weekend, not to mention thousands of orcs still getting away with singing about **** blood and their love of the IRA. That doesn't make this right, or appropriate, but it does make it more difficult for me to be offended by it. Especially when the guy himself hasn't come and condemned it.
  • -2

#2 TRVMP

TRVMP

    Rocket Man! Sad!

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 20879 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:19°17′43″N 166°37′52″E

Posted 19 September 2017 - 01:29 PM

Especially when the guy himself hasn't come and condemned it.

 

What's he supposed to say? "Stop the song, I have a baldy hauf incher."


  • 0

Now before Gavin goes, I'd like to ask him one more question.


Do you like Abba?


#3 TheGoon

TheGoon

    GMFC Supporter

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 3765 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Greenock, what of it?

Posted 19 September 2017 - 01:39 PM

What's he supposed to say? "Stop the song, I have a baldy hauf incher."


Perhaps...that'd make for a hell of a song.
  • 0

#4 TONofmemories

TONofmemories

    GMFC Supporter

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 4244 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 19 September 2017 - 08:15 PM

Can someone rectify the red dot I have very stupidly given Nacho.
  • 0

TIME FOR CHANGE!


#5 TonInDublin

TonInDublin

    GMFC Supporter

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 6855 posts
  • Location:Claonadh, Contae Cill Dara

Posted 19 September 2017 - 08:28 PM

Sorted TonOfMemories.

 

Re the song itself, I like the new one the Stretford End have started singing since the uproar over the original

 

Rooooomeeeellllluuuuu Luuuuukkkkaaaakkkkuuuu

He's our Belgian scoring genius

We can't sing about his penis

We're politically correct

But he's offside when erect

 

Best way to answer it all really ......


  • 0
Two Uniteds but the soul is one, as the Busby Babes carry on.

#6 TONofmemories

TONofmemories

    GMFC Supporter

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 4244 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 19 September 2017 - 08:53 PM

It's an outrage anyway.
  • 0

TIME FOR CHANGE!


#7 TRVMP

TRVMP

    Rocket Man! Sad!

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 20879 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:19°17′43″N 166°37′52″E

Posted 19 September 2017 - 09:15 PM

Can someone rectify the red dot I have very stupidly given Nacho.


Naw havin it.
  • 0

Now before Gavin goes, I'd like to ask him one more question.


Do you like Abba?


#8 cmdc

cmdc

    GMFC Supporter

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 4413 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Greenock

Posted 20 September 2017 - 08:06 AM

Sorted TonOfMemories.

 

Re the song itself, I like the new one the Stretford End have started singing since the uproar over the original

 

Rooooomeeeellllluuuuu Luuuuukkkkaaaakkkkuuuu

He's our Belgian scoring genius

We can't sing about his penis

We're politically correct

But he's offside when erect

 

Best way to answer it all really ......

 

 

*boring intervention klaxon*

 

It's not about political corectness - there's a serious point behind the objections to this: that the 'black man with a large penis' thing was a deliberately constructed stereotype designed to portray black people as animalistic and a threat to white women.


  • 0

#9 Cet Homme Charmant

Cet Homme Charmant

    GMFC Supporter

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 12038 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Leuven, Belgium

Posted 20 September 2017 - 11:12 AM

*boring intervention klaxon*

 

It's not about political corectness - there's a serious point behind the objections to this: that the 'black man with a large penis' thing was a deliberately constructed stereotype designed to portray black people as animalistic and a threat to white women.

I seem to remember that Linford Christie used to get annoyed by the continual 'lunchbox' references to the size of his knob in the media, for this very reason. I also remember an interview where he said that if he had been a white guy who'd won a 100mm Olympic Gold Medal he'd be lauded in the media for his athletic achievement, whereas he felt his achievement was trivialised by them because their obsession about the size of his knob, and he considered that ultimately to be racist.

 

I suppose at the end of the day it's not for us white folk to decide what is and isn't racist for black people. So if Lukaku himself thinks it's offensive or racist, then by definition it is. But if on the other hand he doesn't mind, then why should we?  


Edited by Cet Homme Charmant, 20 September 2017 - 11:26 AM.

  • 0

#10 cmdc

cmdc

    GMFC Supporter

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 4413 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Greenock

Posted 20 September 2017 - 11:25 AM

Yeah, that's right about Linford Christie - he explicitly called it racist. The history of this included black people being castrated (amongst other things) - I think I read that this was particularly acute in Belgium, though you might know more than me about that.

 

None of this is to say that people creating/singing the song are therefore racist - but there's a genuinely good reason why people might object beyond a lazy reference to 'political correctness'.


  • 0

#11 Cet Homme Charmant

Cet Homme Charmant

    GMFC Supporter

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 12038 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Leuven, Belgium

Posted 20 September 2017 - 11:30 AM

Yeah, that's right about Linford Christie - he explicitly called it racist. The history of this included black people being castrated (amongst other things) - I think I read that this was particularly acute in Belgium, though you might know more than me about that.

 

None of this is to say that people creating/singing the song are therefore racist - but there's a genuinely good reason why people might object beyond a lazy reference to 'political correctness'.

As I said, I don't think it's for us to decide if it's racist or not. Only Lukaku himself can make that call. If he's cool with it so am I, but if he finds it offensive or racist then it is.


  • 0

#12 TonInDublin

TonInDublin

    GMFC Supporter

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 6855 posts
  • Location:Claonadh, Contae Cill Dara

Posted 20 September 2017 - 02:12 PM

Just to clear things up, I didn't invent the song, just thought that it was a witty retort to the criticism.

 

Maybe they should have tried something like

 

He's our Belgian scoring genius,

Could have a fanny or a penis

With no comment on its size

In our multi cultural inclusive environment designed to recognise and tap into every individual's unique contributions and diversity

 

Rolls off the bástard lips that little ditty. Mouth lips like, not fanny lips, just to avoid any mysoginistic accusations.


  • 2
Two Uniteds but the soul is one, as the Busby Babes carry on.

#13 TRVMP

TRVMP

    Rocket Man! Sad!

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 20879 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:19°17′43″N 166°37′52″E

Posted 20 September 2017 - 02:24 PM

As I said, I don't think it's for us to decide if it's racist or not. Only Lukaku himself can make that call. If he's cool with it so am I, but if he finds it offensive or racist then it is.

 

I don't disagree but it's a bit s*** that it falls to Lukaku to be the moral arbiter of the great crisis of our time. I know exactly what you mean that it's not for us to decide but at the same time it's got to be a burden on the guy, who didn't really ask for any of this.

 

Really the only solution is for him to CONFIRM OR DENY whether or not he has a baldy half incher.


  • 0

Now before Gavin goes, I'd like to ask him one more question.


Do you like Abba?


#14 capitanus

capitanus

    POINTING AND LAUGHING

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 6474 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:HELLO KITTY

Posted 20 September 2017 - 05:29 PM

Posting this here because we had a similar chant not long ago for Oyenuga. For anyone unsure of what I'm on about, here you go - https://t.co/5FMSDRxNZs
I joined in with the Kudus chant. It was stupid, it is stereotyping, but the guy himself admitted hr liked it. Perhaps that's why I'm struggling to be offended by this, when many others are.
There are so many worse chants/songs belted out at games every weekend, not to mention thousands of orcs still getting away with singing about **** blood and their love of the IRA. That doesn't make this right, or appropriate, but it does make it more difficult for me to be offended by it. Especially when the guy himself hasn't come and condemned it.


What is stupid about it? Personally I thought it was brilliant, in fact it was the only thing about Oyenuga which could be described as brilliant.

Anyway, why is stereotyping so wrong in this respect but the wearing of Viking helmets etc. for the Finnish players thought of with such fondness?
  • 0
Posted Image

#15 capitanus

capitanus

    POINTING AND LAUGHING

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 6474 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:HELLO KITTY

Posted 20 September 2017 - 05:37 PM

*boring intervention klaxon*
 
It's not about political corectness - there's a serious point behind the objections to this: that the 'black man with a large penis' thing was a deliberately constructed stereotype designed to portray black people as animalistic and a threat to white women.


I think that many would regard Pakistani males to be a far greater threat to white women than Afro-Carribean males, regardless the percieved size of their Genitals. The former are renowned for having particularly small tadgers:
http://www.urbandict...term=Paki boner
  • 0
Posted Image

#16 TRVMP

TRVMP

    Rocket Man! Sad!

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 20879 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:19°17′43″N 166°37′52″E

Posted 20 September 2017 - 05:43 PM

I can't let the above outrageous and offensive falsehoods go unchallenged.

Finns are not Vikings.
  • 0

Now before Gavin goes, I'd like to ask him one more question.


Do you like Abba?


#17 TRVMP

TRVMP

    Rocket Man! Sad!

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 20879 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:19°17′43″N 166°37′52″E

Posted 20 September 2017 - 05:45 PM

What is stupid about it? Personally I thought it was brilliant, in fact it was the only thing about Oyenuga which could be described as brilliant.

Anyway, why is stereotyping so wrong in this respect but the wearing of Viking helmets etc. for the Finnish players thought of with such fondness?


cmdc is right - this unfortunate 'mandingo' caricature started off as a negative. You can make a case for saying it's been reclaimed as a point of pride but it's still a bit tawdry.

The vikings, despite a lengthy tradition of rape and plunder, have somehow gathered quite a cuddly image, despite their atrocities (eg spawning Swedes.)
  • 0

Now before Gavin goes, I'd like to ask him one more question.


Do you like Abba?


#18 capitanus

capitanus

    POINTING AND LAUGHING

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 6474 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:HELLO KITTY

Posted 20 September 2017 - 05:46 PM

I can't let the above outrageous and offensive falsehoods go unchallenged.
Finns are not Vikings.


Exactly. And Vikings were renowned for murdering, raping, pillaging and terrorising foreign lands. Not exactly a positive stereotype to give a foreigner.
  • 0
Posted Image

#19 cmdc

cmdc

    GMFC Supporter

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 4413 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Greenock

Posted 20 September 2017 - 11:47 PM

As I said, I don't think it's for us to decide if it's racist or not. Only Lukaku himself can make that call. If he's cool with it so am I, but if he finds it offensive or racist then it is.


Can see your point but racism/stereotyping is about a group so I’m not sure it’s as easy as saying this individual reactedin a particular way.
  • 0

#20 vikingTON

vikingTON

    Award-winning fact-based analysis

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 17000 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Greenock

Posted 21 September 2017 - 07:57 AM

None of this is to say that people creating/singing the song are therefore racist - but there's a genuinely good reason why people might object beyond a lazy reference to 'political correctness'.

 

There's no genuinely good reason to explain why Kick It Out have registered their strongly worded objection though: they're just scrambling for relevance and some extra funding. 

 

A pointless, self-declared arbiter of what is 'offensive': with as much credibility as Nil by Mouth's attempts to tackle sectarianism by declaring, err, just about everything to be 'sectarian'. 


  • 3

The site is supposed to be a place for the extended 'family' of Morton supporters - having an affinity with people that you don't know, because you share a love of your local football club. It's not supposed to be about point scoring and showing how 'clever' or 'funny' you are, or just being downright rude and offensive to people you don't know, because you can get away with it. Unfortunately, it seems the classic case of people who have little standing/presence in real life, use this forum as a way of making themselves feel as if they are something. It's sad, and I've said that before..

So, having been on Morton forums for about 15 years I guess, I've had enough... well done t*ssers, another Morton supporter driven away. You can all feel happy at how 'clever' you are


#21 TRVMP

TRVMP

    Rocket Man! Sad!

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 20879 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:19°17′43″N 166°37′52″E

Posted 21 September 2017 - 08:10 AM

There's no genuinely good reason to explain why Kick It Out have registered their strongly worded objection though: they're just scrambling for relevance and some extra funding. 

 

A pointless, self-declared arbiter of what is 'offensive': with as much credibility as Nil by Mouth's attempts to tackle sectarianism by declaring, err, just about everything to be 'sectarian'. 

 

I remember a few years ago Paul Elliott had to step down from Kick It Out for calling another black man the n-word, which seemed to me hugely ridiculous and massively unfair to him. He also got kicked off the FA thing he was on. Then again, he'd be well aware that language is power and that the walls have ears.


  • 0

Now before Gavin goes, I'd like to ask him one more question.


Do you like Abba?


#22 cmdc

cmdc

    GMFC Supporter

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 4413 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Greenock

Posted 21 September 2017 - 08:34 AM

There's no genuinely good reason to explain why Kick It Out have registered their strongly worded objection though: they're just scrambling for relevance and some extra funding.

A pointless, self-declared arbiter of what is 'offensive': with as much credibility as Nil by Mouth's attempts to tackle sectarianism by declaring, err, just about everything to be 'sectarian'.

The genuinely good reason is that football fans were singing and spreading a song (in the sense that clips of it had been widely shared) based on a racist stereotype that black athletes in the past have been quick to condemn (see the Christie example above). It’s not just an example of classing ‘everything’ as racist: it’s calling out/informing people about the negative connotations of the song/stereotype.

Edited by cmdc, 21 September 2017 - 08:35 AM.

  • 0

#23 Cet Homme Charmant

Cet Homme Charmant

    GMFC Supporter

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 12038 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Leuven, Belgium

Posted 21 September 2017 - 08:35 AM



Can see your point but racism/stereotyping is about a group so I’m not sure it’s as easy as saying this individual reactedin a particular way.

 

You're conflating racism and stereotyping though, and they're not always the same thing. While of course some racial stereotyping could be considered to be overtly racist by most reasonable people, it's not necessarily the case that all stereotyping is. For example, some black males may take their stereotypical association with big knobs as a compliment and something to be proud of. Surely as by and large we're not the victims of racism and racial stereotyping, it's not really for us to decide on behalf of black people what they should and shouldn't  be offended by. I'd take the thoughts and opinions of Lukaku himself on this matter far more seriously than some unelected Quango who unilaterally declare themselves to be society's arbitrators of what is and isn't offensive.

 

If Lukaku himself says he finds the song offensive and/or racist then they should stop singing it immediately. Otherwise it's a non-issue IMO.


  • 1

#24 TRVMP

TRVMP

    Rocket Man! Sad!

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 20879 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:19°17′43″N 166°37′52″E

Posted 21 September 2017 - 08:37 AM

 

You're conflating racism and stereotyping though, and they're not always the same thing. While of course some racial stereotyping could be considered to be overtly racist by most reasonable people, it's not necessarily the case that all stereotyping is. For example, some black males may take their stereotypical association with big knobs as a compliment and something to be proud of. Surely as by and large we're not the victims of racism and racial stereotyping, it's not really for us to decide on behalf of black people what they should and shouldn't  be offended by. I'd take the thoughts and opinions of Lukaku himself on this matter far more seriously than some unelected Quango who unilaterally declare themselves to be society's arbitrators of what is and isn't offensive.

 

If Lukaku himself says he finds the song offensive and/or racist then they should stop singing it immediately. Otherwise it's a non-issue IMO.

 

Quick note - it's far from unilateral. Kick It Out is funded in the main by the FA. They are as close to an official body as there is, other than the FA itself, on this subject. 


  • 0

Now before Gavin goes, I'd like to ask him one more question.


Do you like Abba?


#25 cmdc

cmdc

    GMFC Supporter

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 4413 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Greenock

Posted 21 September 2017 - 08:39 AM


You're conflating racism and stereotyping though, and they're not always the same thing. While of course some racial stereotyping could be considered to be overtly racist by most reasonable people, it's not necessarily the case that all stereotyping is. For example, some black males may take their stereotypical association with big knobs as a compliment and something to be proud of. Surely as by and large we're not the victims of racism and racial stereotyping, it's not really for us to decide on behalf of black people what they should and shouldn't be offended by. I'd take the thoughts and opinions of Lukaku himself on this matter far more seriously than some unelected Quango who unilaterally declare themselves to be society's arbitrators of what is and isn't offensive.

If Lukaku himself says he finds the song offensive and/or racist then they should stop singing it immediately. Otherwise it's a non-issue IMO.


Yes but this is a racist stereotype with a pretty grim history. Hence why black players and people more generally might with good reason find it offensive (just to repeat the Linford Christie example because it’s at the top of my head and high profile) even if Lukaku himself does not (which isn’t clear).
  • 0


0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users